5B.5.6.1 Dismounts: Uphill
This discussion has an associated proposal. View Proposal Details here.Comments about this discussion:
Started
If the Uphill race is run as a time trial, riders are intended to ride the entire distance.
In the event of a dismount, the rider must remount the unicycle:
(a) At the point where the dismount occurred if the unicycle falls back down the course
toward the start.
(b) Where the unicycle and/or rider come to a stop after dismounting. Excessive
running/walking/stumbling after a dismount may be grounds for a penalty at the
discretion of the Referee.
(c) Riders may also choose to back up (toward the start line) from one of those spots
to remount, if they prefer the terrain there.
My suggestion: Summarise a+b to the follow:
"At the point of the first body contact with the ground." (no matter if falling in front or back)
In my opinion this would be much more easier for the referees. It is really easy to see and identify the point of the first body/foot contact with the ground.
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Good point. Simple is better so long as it covers the intended rule. I think this does.
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Could using "first body contact" be abused? Say there's a root or something that a rider is having trouble getting over. If they hit it and fall off forward, it's likely their first foot/body contact will be infront of the root, which means they could remount after the root and don't have to successfully ride over the root. Riders could intentionally leap forward to avoid problematic sections. When I was being instructed as a judge one year, I got the impression that the intention of the rule is that riders must ride all portions of the course, so if you fall, you must remount at or behind what caused you to fall. If that's the case, I feel like the location of the wheel when the dismount occurred would be better (although I do agree it's not quite as easy for judges as using first body/foot contact).
Comment
I'm all for simplification, but in this case, as Danielle said, it really changes the rules. Riders would not need to clear every difficult section, they could just dismount in a way to land with their feet past the obstacle. The location of the wheel would make more sense I think.
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I agree with you Ben.
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I agree with Danielle and Ben.
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Yes, I think, the rule was made for this issue. Nonetheless I would change the rule like I suggested. Assuming there's a root where only a few top riders are able to pass over pedaling normally. The course is narrow and the only way is to pass over the root. So the actually rule says that everybody has to pass over the root. Soon there will be a crowd of riders that try to jump over. For the race this would not be a good situation. I would change the rule, because a dismount - even if intentional - is always slower than pedaling normally over the obstacle. So, I think, my suggestion would not be abused, but helps to avoid bottlenecks during the race.
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I don't think people would intentionally abuse the rule, but I think it would naturally happen. Typically when you fall you land after the obstacle that caused you to fall, so you would naturally start after the obstacle unless the rules require you to go back and retry the obstacle.
For top riders who can likely ride everything on their first or second try, it's true that riding is always faster than dismounting. But for many riders, successfully riding every portion of the course is a challenge in itself and so the number of times they need to re-try a particular section plays a huge role in how fast they end up riding the course. The course in Montreal was a prime example of this, many riders spent multiple attempts on specific obstacles (some of which eventually gave up and didn't finish) and the final placing would be radically different with this proposed change.
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Yes, you are right. The results would be different: On a difficult course much more competitors will be able to finish the race. But I think the order of the ranking will be OK. I remember UNIOECs Uphill. For the best riders (they started first) it wasn't a problem. But soon there were up to ten people trying to pass the difficult point, obstracting each other. This situation remained until the end of the race. The referee at this point was really active and managed the situation a well as possible. He stopped the riders after a few ineffective attempts to give a change the next one. So I think we should try to avoid situations like this. My suggestion will not totally avoid such situations, but it would help. At the same time we facilitate the job of the referee. And regarding the results: a dismount - even if intentional - is always slower than pedaling.
Comment
A dismount - even if intentional - is always slower than pedaling but not hopping. If there is a section where people have to hop over it would be much quicker for them to dismount so they fall over the obstacle so they can remount and avoid the obstacle than for them to stop and try and hop over it. IMHO this is what we are trying to avoid.
Not sure how to avoid a bottleneck over a very difficult section but it shouldn't affect the top riders anyways so it shouldn't be an issue as the riders who have difficulty won't be placing for a medal.
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what does IMHO mean?
".... but not hopping." Yes you are right, hopping is slower. bot this is what i meant. My opinion is to avoid hopping-points. this points causes bottlenecks. and those are not fine for competitors. a race consists not only of top riders. the race should be a good experience even for non-elite competitors.
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Imho=in my humble opinion
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Hoping is a basic skill, very helpfull in difficult situations thus should not be excluded from muni racing.
Bottlenecks arise due to narrow trails and high number of participants. If we care for non-elite riders at World Championships than we cannot expect satisfying difficulty for elite riders.
I disagree with "first body contact" rule proposal.
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Ok. So, how could we simplify this rule? I really think we should facilitate the job for the referees. Would you agree with Bens suggestion: "the location of the wheel at the moment of the dismount" ??
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"the location of the wheel at the moment of the dismount" is simply good, I agree.
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ok. Shall I make the proposal?
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I agree with "the location of the wheel at the moment of the dismount", as a good simplification.
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May I suggest one small edit:
"Riders must ride the entire course. In the event of a dismount, the rider must remount the unicycle at the location of the wheel at the moment of the dismount. Riders may also choose to back up (toward the start line) to remount, if they prefer the terrain there."
See italics. It really says the same thing, but "distance" to me was somehow implying that it had to be a continuous run without dismounts. I hope that people who keep getting stuck at the same spot will figure out that they can back up and take a different line to get over the obstacle!